===== Sydney F2F February 1-3 2016 ===== * Host: Google * Dates: Monday-Wednesday, February 01-3, 2016 (with SVG on Wednesday) * Times: Doors will open from 8:30am. Meeting can run from 9:00am - 6:30pm as required. ==== Meeting Minutes ==== * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0205.html|Wednesday, 1 Feb Part I: Web Compat Challenges]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0206.html|Wednesday, 1 Feb Part II: Tables, Colors, Transforms]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0207.html|Wednesday, 1 Feb Part III: Writing Modes, Line Grid]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0208.html|Wednesday, 1 Feb Part IV: Overflow]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0350.html|Thursday, 2 Feb Part I: A report on research into automatic layout, CSS Text]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0351.html|Thursday, 2 Feb Part II: Round Display]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0352.html|Thursday, 2 Feb Part III: Behavior of contains:paint and overflow:clip, text-overflow and resize properties; CSS Text; Exclusions and bidi]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0353.html|Thursday, 2 Feb Part IV: Snap Points, bookmark-level: auto, Sizing]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0357.html|Friday, 3 Feb Part I: 2017 F2F Meetings, Scroll-linked Animations]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0358.html|Friday, 3 Feb Part II: Fill & Stroke on CSS Text]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0359.html|Friday, 3 Feb Part III: SVG Text Issues]] * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Mar/0360.html|Friday, 3 Feb Part IV: CSS Masking, Filters, Gradients & Dithering, Investigation about JS API for Realizing Level of Details, Transitions and Animations, Matrices]] ==== Adjacent meetings ==== * 2016-01-30..31 [[https://github.com/w3c/css-houdini-drafts/wiki/Sydney-F2F-January-2016|Houdini Meeting]] in Sydney * 2016-02-03 Joint meeting between CSS and SVG in Sydney * 2016-02-04..06 [[http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/wiki/F2F/Sydney_2016|SVG WG Meeting]] in Sydney ==== Dates to schedule around ==== * 2016-01-12..15 [[https://github.com/w3ctag/meetings/tree/gh-pages/2016/01-mel|TAG Meeting]] in Melbourne, Australia * 2016-01-30..31 FOSDEM in Brussels, Belgium * 2016-02-01..05 [[http://linux.conf.au/|linux.conf.au]], Geelong (near Melbourne), Australia ==== Place ==== Google Sydney: Level 5, 48 Pirrama Road, Pyrmont [[https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zJ65I1F7fhHg.kXMVcT5RKNhU|This map]] might help. **Meeting Rooms** * Main room: * Corroboree, on Level 5 (opposite reception). * Breakout rooms: * Monday: Barangaroo, on Level 4 (all day) - 42 person room * Tuesday AM: Howzat, on Level 6 (9am-1pm) - 14 person room * Tuesday PM: Dreamtime, on Level 5 (1pm-5:30pm) - 18 person room * Wednesday AM: Dreamtime, on Level 5 (9am-1pm) - 18 person room * Wednesday PM: Redback, on Level 6 (1pm-5:30pm) - 16 person room **Instructions for arrival**: Please come directly up to level 5. A security guard will let you in and I will have a badge for you. If you arrive after 9:30am, please either: * call Shane Stephens on +61 405 491 744; or * log on to the free Google Guest wifi (which should be accessible from the ground floor) and ping someone on #css. **Parking**: If you think you'd like to drive to the meeting, please let Shane know and he will try and book parking for you at Google. **Parking is limited**. There are also parking stations nearby, particularly [[http://www.wilsonparking.com.au/go/wilson-car-parks/nsw/harbourside|Harbourside]]. === Visa Requirements ==== A visa is required for US Citizens to enter Australia (citizens of other countries please check with the appropriate authorities), a visa may be obtained electronically from the [[http://www.eta.immi.gov.au/|Electronic Travel Authority web site]]. For various other nationalities, you're supposed to get a https://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Visa-1/651- ==== Participants ===== Please, put your name in this table if you plan to participate (alphabetical order by given name): ^ Name ^ Arrival ^ Departure ^ Hotel ^ Flight info and notes ^ | Alan Stearns | Jan 26 | Feb 6 | ?? | ?? | | Andrey Rybka | Jan 31 | Feb 3 | Oaks Goldsbrough Apartments | AirNZ | | Bert Bos | Jan 29 | Feb 4 | The Haven Glebe | VA891/VA640 | | Brian Birtles | Jan 23 | Feb 9 | Oaks Goldsbrough Apartments | JAL | | Dean Jackson | ?? | ?? | ?? | ?? | | Edward O'Connor | Jan 30 | Feb 6 | Sheraton on the Park | UA 863 / UA 870 | | fantasai | Jan 30 | Feb 5 | Airbnb | NZ15+NZ103 / NZ104+NZ8 | | Florian Rivoal | Jan 31 | Feb 4 | Airbnb | KE728+KE121 / KE122+KE721 | | Greg Whitworth | Jan 27 | Feb 4 | ?? | ?? | | Hiroshi Sakakibara | Jan 31 | Feb 4 | ?? | ?? | | Hyojin Song | Jan 30, 08:40 | Feb 4 | Airbnb | OZ601 / OZ602 | | Ian Kilpatrick | Jan 26 | Feb 7 | ?? | Qantas | | Ian Vollick | Jan 29 | Feb 2 | ?? | United | | Jihye Hong | Jan 30, 08:40 | Feb 4 | Airbnb | OZ601 / OZ602 | | Joone Hur | Jan 29 08:35 | Feb 5 14:30 | Airbnb | UA 863 / UA 870 | | Koji Ishii | ?? | 2016-02-04(?) | ?? | ?? | | L. David Baron | 29 Jan, 14:35 | 6 Feb, 14:30 | Airbnb / ?? | ANZ119 / UAL870 | | Jet Villegas | 29 Jan, 14:35 | 5 Feb, 11:50 | Sydney Travelodge / ?? | ANZ119 / ANZ104 | | Peter Linss | Jan 28/29 | Feb 8 | Novotel Sydney | Car / UA840 | | Rossen Atanassov | Jan 29 | Feb 8 | ?? | pescatarian | | Simon Fraser | ?? | ?? | ?? | ?? | | Simon Pieters | Jan 29 (22:30) | Feb 3 (21:45) | Airbnb | QF 8414 / QF 8413 | | Steve Zilles | Jan 27 | Feb 4 | Merton Serviced Apartments | UA | | Takao Baba | Jan 31 | Feb 4 | ?? | ?? | | Tantek Çelik | 2016-01-30 08:35 | 2016-02-04 14:30 | Airbnb | UAL863 / UAL870 | **Regrets** * Dave Cramer * Dael Jackson * Dongwoo Joshua Im * Chris Lilley (travel budget, Bert will attend) * Brad Kemper (but would like to call in or Skype in or whatever during Sydney mornings, especially for the round display stuff) //**Please note that Jan 26 is a public holiday in Australia**// === Network === The GoogleGuest network will be available throughout the building. No password is required. ==== Travel to/from airport ==== A taxi from the airport to the meeting venue will cost between $30 and $50, depending on traffic. There's generally only a short wait to get a taxi, and a fairly orderly queue. This is probably the most convenient, and also the cheapest if you share with others... If staying in Chinatown, the [[http://www.airportlink.com.au/directions/sydney-city.php|airport train line]] is reasonably convenient. A one-way ticket is $16.40. If you're staying in Pyrmont, you can still take the train, then jump on the [[http://www.sydneylightrail.transport.nsw.gov.au/|light rail]] from 'Central' to 'the Star'. You'll need to pay $4.60 (in cash) after boarding the train. Some hotels offer complimentary bus transfers to/from the airport - check with your hotel when booking. === Money === The [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_dollar|Australian dollar (AUD)]]. See [[http://www.oanda.com/currency/table?exch=AUD&sel_list=USD_EUR_GBP_JPY_NOK_SEK_NZD_CNY_TWD_KRW&value=1&format=HTML&redirected=1|exchange rates]]. You should be able to use your credit card pretty much everywhere (especially Mastercard and Visa). Diners Club cards tend to attract a fee or not be accepted. Checks are not generally accepted. === Electricity === 230V, 50Hz, 10A [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AS/NZS_3112|flat, angled awesome pins]] {{https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Australian_dual_switched_power_point.jpg}} Notice the small switch on the side. Unless you flip it on, don't expect the power socket to do much for you. ==== Schedule ==== === Monday AM === * CSS Web Compat challenges (tantek, Daniel to call in, rbyers leaving Mon) * E.g. 0 vs 0deg: * https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1234357 * https://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=569703 * How do we decide to fix browsers vs fix spec? Like for this 0 vs 0deg example. * How do we get browser vendors to report when they implement *new* quirks (presumably for web compat)? * How do we get member sites to stop depending on CSS vendor prefixes? (e.g. Gmail [[https://twitter.com/tabatkins/status/674620970523430914|“yelling at the internal teams”]]) * Tables specification (Greg, François to call in) * table header and footer repetition: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0135.html (Florian) * Applying css-containment to table cells https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2015Aug/0141.html (florian) * Colors * Supported extended color displays: outside-sRGB colors, media queries etc. (smfr) Prefer Monday. * CSS Transforms: path and obstacles to CR? === Monday PM === * CSS Writing Modes * [[http://kojiishi.github.io/generate-w3c-implementation-report/css-writing-modes-3/status-2016-01.html|test status]] and the road to PR/REC [koji] * Line-grid * [[https://github.com/kojiishi/snap-height|Snap heights]] -- a simpler [[https://drafts.csswg.org/css-line-grid/|Line Grid]]? [koji] * inline-grid / character-grid: The MVP for good CJK layout http://www.w3.org/mid/31B1844A-8D09-481C-8688-985AE82A6770@rivoal.net (florian) * [[http://drafts.csswg.org/css-overflow-3/|CSS Overflow]] - open issues and how to fix them === Tuesday AM === * CSS Houdini FPWD specs * A report on research into automatic layout (Bert). (Just before the ftf, I'll be in Melbourne to talk to, among others, researchers at Monash. I expect I'll come back with some interesting things to report on.) 30 mins? (Daniel and François to call in) * CSS Text * Aligning table columns on decimal point and its variations, including [[https://drafts.csswg.org/css-text-4/#character-alignment|issue 18 in css-text-4 ED]] and [[http://w3c.github.io/dpub-pagination/#tables|tables section of dpub-latinreq ED]]. Also discussed on list starting [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0233.html|here]] (Bert)(Dave C. would like to call in for this) * CSS Round Display (Brad K to call in) * Percentages of 'polar-distance' when origin is not the center of the containing block https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0152.html (jihye) * Polar positioning in absolute positioning https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0134.html (jihye, brad) * Using polar properties as CSS 3D transforms function https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0217.html (joone) * Suggest a new type of pseudo-class to support scrolling in rounded viewports https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0255.html (jihye) * Change device-radius to device-corner-radius in the spec https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2015Oct/0220.html (hyojin) * Extension of @viewport rule - two types of viewport(inner/outer of the display shape) (hyojin) * Robustness of CSS on non rectangular displays https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0050.html (florian) * Revision of CSS Round Display WD === Tuesday PM === * Behavior of contains:paint and overflow:clip, text-overflow and resize properties (Ojan) * Font OM * Status of https://tabatkins.github.io/specs/css-font-display/ (smfr/dino/hober) * CSS Text * white-space: pre-wrap / pre-wrap-auto http://www.w3.org/mid/56402730.50405@inkedblade.net (florian) * text-wrap: balance and fragmentation http://www.w3.org/mid/36D11879-0E75-4172-BE7E-7A97C0F11F01@rivoal.net (florian) * CSS Text Decorations (koji) * text-underline-position [[https://readable-email.org/list/www-style/topic/css-text-decor-doesn-t-example-3-in-text-underline-position-break-current-ua-behavior|www-style thread]] * CSS Exclusions and bidi (koji, shane) * Doesn't seem to be any specification prose describing the interaction. * Snap-points * Applicability to pseudo-elements https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0193.html (florian) * Snappability of unreachable elements https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0191.html (florian) * indirect scrolling https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0296.html (florian) * Is this still relevant, or do snap-points cover its use cases https://tabatkins.github.io/specs/css-sticky-scrollbars/ (florian) * "bookmark-level: auto" Possible? Needed? https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2015Nov/0310.html (florian) * UAs behave differently (Webkit/Blink vs Gecko/Edge/AHF/Prince) for relative positioning and fragmentation: http://jsbin.com/fuloge/1/edit?html,css,output (florian) === Wednesday AM === * Upcoming meetings == Track 1 == * [[http://drafts.csswg.org/css-text-decor-4/|Fill/Stroke on CSS Text]] * [[https://webkit.org/blog/164/background-clip-text/|background-clip: text]] (jet) * Text issues (http://tavmjong.free.fr/SVG/TEXT_SYDNEY_2016/) (Tav) https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3A%22Needs+CSS+WG%22 * 'dominant-baseline' * Text wrapping * CSS Sizing * CSS Alignment == Track 2 == * fast-tracking customized scrolling (shane) === Wednesday PM === * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-fx/2015OctDec/0021.html|conflicting auto values in mask shorthand (mask-mode must not have auto)]] (dbaron) (maybe an FX topic) * CSS Transitions and Animations: path and obstacles to CR? * Filters: (Tav) * Avoiding artifacts with lighting filters. * Status of Filters Level 1 * Filters Level 2 * Investigation about JS API for realizing Level of Details (Proposals/Investigation_of_APIs_for_Level_of_detail) (Stakagi : I will arrive at noon. ) ==== Proposed topics ==== === CSSWG === * CSS Round Display * Robustness of CSS on non rectangular displays https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0050.html (florian) * issues and new ideas - to be updated (hyojin) * Percentages of 'polar-distance' when origin is not the center of the containing block https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0152.html (jihye) * Polar positioning in absolute positioning https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0134.html (jihye, brad) * Suggest a new type of pseudo-class to support scrolling in rounded viewports https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0255.html (jihye) * Using polar properties as CSS 3D transforms function(joone). https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0217.html * CSS Text * white-space: pre-wrap / pre-wrap-auto http://www.w3.org/mid/56402730.50405@inkedblade.net (florian) * text-wrap: balance and fragmentation http://www.w3.org/mid/36D11879-0E75-4172-BE7E-7A97C0F11F01@rivoal.net (florian) * Aligning table columns on decimal point and its variations, including [[https://drafts.csswg.org/css-text-4/#character-alignment|issue 18 in css-text-4 ED]] and [[http://w3c.github.io/dpub-pagination/#tables|tables section of dpub-latinreq ED]]. Also discussed on list starting [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0233.html|here]] (Bert)(Dave C. would like to call in for this) * Tables specification (Greg) * table header and footer repetition: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0135.html (Florian) * A report on research into automatic layout (Bert). (Just before the ftf, I'll be in Melbourne to talk to, among others, researchers at Monash. I expect I'll come back with some interesting things to report on.) 30 mins? * CSS Text Decorations (koji) * text-underline-position [[https://readable-email.org/list/www-style/topic/css-text-decor-doesn-t-example-3-in-text-underline-position-break-current-ua-behavior|www-style thread]] * CSS Writing Modes * [[http://kojiishi.github.io/generate-w3c-implementation-report/css-writing-modes-3/status-2016-01.html|test status]] and the road to PR/REC [koji] * Line-grid * [[https://github.com/kojiishi/snap-height|Snap heights]] -- a simpler [[https://drafts.csswg.org/css-line-grid/|Line Grid]]? [koji] * inline-grid / character-grid: The MVP for good CJK layout http://www.w3.org/mid/31B1844A-8D09-481C-8688-985AE82A6770@rivoal.net (florian) * Colors * Supported extended color displays: outside-sRGB colors, media queries etc. (smfr) Prefer Monday. * Font OM * Status of https://tabatkins.github.io/specs/css-font-display/ (smfr/dino/hober) * [[http://drafts.csswg.org/css-overflow-3/|CSS Overflow]] - open issues and how to fix them * CSS Web Compat challenges (tantek) * E.g. 0 vs 0deg: * https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1234357 * https://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=569703 * How do we decide to fix browsers vs fix spec? Like for this 0 vs 0deg example. * How do we get browser vendors to report when they implement *new* quirks (presumably for web compat)? * How do we get member sites to stop depending on CSS vendor prefixes? (e.g. Gmail [[https://twitter.com/tabatkins/status/674620970523430914|“yelling at the internal teams”]]) * CSS Exclusions and bidi (koji, shane) * Doesn't seem to be any specification prose describing the interaction. * Snap-points * Applicability to pseudo-elements https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0193.html (florian) * Snappability of unreachable elements https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0191.html (florian) * indirect scrolling https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Jan/0296.html (florian) * Is this still relevant, or do snap-points cover its use cases https://tabatkins.github.io/specs/css-sticky-scrollbars/ (florian) * "bookmark-level: auto" Possible? Needed? https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2015Nov/0310.html (florian) * Applying css-containment to table cells https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2015Aug/0141.html (florian) Extra topics: * CSS-Break: * UAs behave differently (Webkit/Blink vs Gecko/Edge/AHF/Prince) for relative positioning and fragmentation: http://jsbin.com/fuloge/1/edit?html,css,output (florian) === FXTF(Special Effects Task Force) === * [[https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-fx/2015OctDec/0021.html|conflicting auto values in mask shorthand (mask-mode must not have auto)]] (dbaron) (maybe an FX topic) * [[http://drafts.csswg.org/css-text-decor-4/|Fill/Stroke on CSS Text]] * CSS Transforms: path and obstacles to CR? * CSS Transitions and Animations: path and obstacles to CR? * [[https://webkit.org/blog/164/background-clip-text/|background-clip: text]] (jet)